Why ditching social media rules might be the best strategy | Ep. 35 Content Magic with Lindsay Smith

In this episode I'm joined by Sarah Weiss, an Instagram and TikTok marketing mentor and honestly, this is one of the best convos about content.

Sarah and I chat about repurposing content, throwing all the social media rules out the window, trying new things, showing up as your OWN self and ditching the impostor syndrome. 

We are also get into some of the myths (and truths) about TikTok and Instagram, how to reach new audiences, where to spend your time for organic reach and the importance of moving your social media followers to an email list and the idea of nurturing a small audience before you can serve a bigger one. 

Also, P.S. I have a new email podcast series coming out soon! 

We also get into Threads and how it's become a great place to hang out for refreshing, real conversations. 

Don't miss this one! It's a goodie.
 
06:21 Adapt, be flexible, and gamify change mindset.
09:28 Adapting to TikTok's search engine; unique persona.
12:34 Authenticity is important for building relationships.
14:32 Publicly share chronic illness experiences to connect.
19:25 Fiancé's mom proud of Instagram content sharing.
22:14 Growth in followers boosted income through conversion.
25:56 Focus on skill, not numbers, for validation.
27:24 Acknowledge preconceived notions when admiring professionals.
32:36 Offer free content to build your audience.
35:48 Content is vital, keep it simple.
39:58 Threads is an organic awareness platform for networking.
41:18 Spontaneous sharing without planned intentions or boundaries.
45:40 Find me on TikTok and Instagram. Membership available.

CONNECT WITH SARAH!
Instagram: @onbrandbysarah
TikTok: @onbrandbysarah
Free podcast series: Social Media Sales Funnel
Website: onbrandbysarah.com

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Lindsay [00:00:00]:
And I also say so much of content strategy is just like repetition, repetition, repetition.

Sarah [00:00:04]:
I always say, if you sound like a broken record, you're doing an amazing job.

Lindsay [00:00:08]:
If you have an online business, you're creating content. And the way you create content is more important than ever. It's really noisy out there, and learning to stand out is the only way. Hey, I'm Lindsay, and I'm the host of the content Magic podcast, all about being an entrepreneur and creating kick ass content to market yourself and your business. I have a not so secret super for copywriting, marketing and content, and I've helped hundreds of folks just like you show up with a ton of confidence in the online space. I've been doing this content thing for 20 years, and I believe the real magic is a combo of intuition, creativity, and strategy. You can create content for your business without losing your mind, I promise. So tune in every week for tangible content tips, inspiring guests, and some real spicy opinions.

Lindsay [00:01:00]:
Probably mine. Ready to dive in? Let's go. Hi, friends. Welcome back to the podcast. And I am very excited to introduce you to my friend, Sarah. Hi, Sarah.

Sarah [00:01:12]:
Hi. I'm so stoked to be here.

Lindsay [00:01:14]:
Yay. So I'm going to get you to introduce yourself. So why don't you tell the people where you are, who you are, and who you help? Yeah.

Sarah [00:01:23]:
So I'm Sarah, or on brand by Sarah, on the social media streets. I'm a New Jersey girly. I can never be too far away from a Broadway show. I'm a Broadway musical nerd, and I am an online business mentor, and I help you turn your content into dolla dollar bills. I also have, like, a major specialty in TikTok. I was one of, like one of the first online business baddies that got their Battuti onto TikTok. And so it's done wonders for my business. And I've been able to help lots of other business owners do the same.

Sarah [00:01:59]:
I love me some TikTok, and that's what I do.

Lindsay [00:02:03]:
Love that. So, can you tell us a little bit about how you became an entrepreneur?

Sarah [00:02:10]:
Absolutely. So I used to be a speech therapist. It has nothing to do with marketing or business or entrepreneurship, but I was a speech therapist for about two to three years, and I worked with very high needs populations, which I absolutely loved. But I am a chronic illness, girly. I have fibromyalgia and chronic migraines, and so it just was not sustainable for me. It was not. I got burnt out very quickly, and so I would listen to these business and entrepreneur podcasts on my way to work, and it wasn't like, oh, this would be nice, like, if I could do this. It was like, oh, no, no.

Sarah [00:02:49]:
Like, when I do this, and I started as, like, a social media manager. So, like, picture someone, like, creating the content posting for you and all that stuff. I started as that. I replaced my speech salary within six months of starting my business, which I fully understand, and take ownership. That that is not the norm. So please don't think I'm like, you can make a million dollars in six months. That's not my mo. I did get very lucky, but I also worked very hard, and I just kind of acted as if and whenever I'm saying this story, I'm like, you do not have to agree or follow my path at all.

Sarah [00:03:33]:
But I was very much a fake it till you make it kind of girly. I never told anybody I was new. I never told anybody that I didn't know something. I would just figure it out. I just figured out. And, I mean, listen, if you are, like, helping somebody with, like, I don't know, like, systems can't, right? You really have to know, like, the exact system. Like, obviously, just tell them. Like, you might need some training, but, like, anything else, I was like, I can figure it out.

Sarah [00:04:00]:
I'm very resourceful. There were a lot of things in speech that I didn't know, and I think that no matter what career or niche or industry you're in, the most powerful thing you can say is, like, I'm not sure, but I will totally go find the answer. Like, that's the best thing that you can do. And so I just did that. I faked it till I make it. I make that till you make it. And here we are.

Lindsay [00:04:25]:
I love that. And I think. And you know what I love about your content is that there's, like. And I feel like that that's probably where it comes from. Like, you. There's, like, no apologies, and you're just like, I'm gonna show up and be who I am, and everybody else can just get lost. And so. And I think what you and I have in common is that there's this permission piece, right? Like, at the time of this recording, there was, like, some Instagram, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Lindsay [00:04:57]:
No more calls to action. And then it disappeared, and everybody got all up in there all stressed and. Right. And I think, what? Like, it's this permission to just be like, can we just, like, all the rules, just fuck off and, like, do what we want and create content that's fun. And that talk speaks to our ideal client, and I feel like you and I have that in common.

Sarah [00:05:21]:
Yes. And I don't know if you saw my stories that day. I hope you did, but that I literally posted something that is the embodiment of what you just said. So I had a headache that day. So I was. Have you ever used one of those, like, ice pack masks?

Lindsay [00:05:36]:
Yes, I have one.

Sarah [00:05:38]:
Okay. So I had my ice pack mask, I pulled it up over my eyes, and it looked like I was in a bathing cap. And I got onto my Instagram stories, and I was like, y'all need to stop freaking the fuck out.

Lindsay [00:05:50]:
Same thing in my stories.

Sarah [00:05:52]:
Yes. There is no data that this doesn't work anymore. It's. It keeps working every single day for people. Keep doing things until it stops working. That was my story. And it literally, I was laying in bed. It looked like I was wearing a bathing cap.

Sarah [00:06:04]:
But it's like, I'm sorry. I get that. Like, I get that our. For a lot of us, our businesses, our livelihood, but if you have this, like, it has to work. It has to work. It has to work. It's always a fire. It's always a panic.

Sarah [00:06:21]:
First of all, your audience can feel that, and it is not going to draw people to you. And second of all, you're going to burn yourself out so quickly. So quickly. The best thing that we can be as business owners and entrepreneurs is just adapt and be flexible, which I know is not easy for everyone. But, like, if you have that in your mind of, like, you know what? Things are going to change all the frigging time. I'm just gonna, like, I'm gonna roll with it. I'm gonna gamify it.

Lindsay [00:06:57]:
Yes. And something I say all the time is that, you know, one of the most, the beautiful parts of entrepreneurship is you can do what you want, but also on the other side, it doing what you want doesn't always work. Right? So. And I agree. Right. It's just, like, experimental thing, and you do get better and better at it. But, yes, I agree. And I think, you know, and I want to talk about TikTok some more because I don't know how to tick tock, and I want you to tell us, so.

Lindsay [00:07:31]:
But, yes, I agree. It's kind of like a double edged sword. It's like, you can do anything you want. Also, you can do anything you want. Right. Like, it's that too. Anyways, so let's shift gears to TikTok, because I did your TikTok challenge and I failed miserably I don't know how to. I don't know how to TikTok.

Lindsay [00:07:47]:
So I want you to tell us, one, how you grew your business that way, and two, anybody who is, like, curious, TikTok curious, I want you to tell us what we need to know.

Sarah [00:08:04]:
Yeah. So I got on TikTok at the very start of my business. I'm a very all or nothing person. I went from only posting canva graphics on my Facebook business page to saying, wow, that doesn't work. And then going to reels on Instagram and videos on TikTok, and I was like, oh, that works. People need to see me, feel my vibe, hear my personality, because. And I was just, I just talked about this with somebody else. I can't remember who it was, but there's such a sea of sameness in the online space, okay? And I know that a lot of people approach it with.

Sarah [00:08:48]:
With, like, the best intentions. Like, they're really just trying to emulate or copy what they see successful, quote unquote, people doing. And so I always say, like, you don't know what you don't know. And so I'm not. I'm not trying to villainize those people. But anyway, I got onto TikTok. Can I curse on here?

Lindsay [00:09:07]:
Yes.

Sarah [00:09:08]:
Okay. I got onto TikTok, and I still get onto TikTok with the fuck around and find out strategy again. When I got onto TikTok, there were very few online business owners on TikTok. Very few. There was, like. Like, I can probably count on one hand. Like, there's a web designer. I'm still very friendly with her.

Sarah [00:09:28]:
There was, like, a copywriter and SEO person. There were, like, a few social media managers that, like, immediately blew up, but, like, it wasn't, like, super crowded with people. And so I was like, nobody knows me on TikTok, so I'm just gonna fuck around and find out what works, okay? And let me tell you something. TikTok is amazing because it's a search engine now. And so I'll get likes and comments on videos that I've posted three years ago, and I clicked on a video that was posted three years ago because I got a notification on it, and that Sarah and this Sarah are, like, totally different people. Like, the way that I spoke was just so, like, prim and proper. Like, I looked very uncomfortable, and now I got on there, and I'm like, listen, honey boo boo, let me tell you about, you know what I mean? But that's how we, that's how everybody is, right? That's how everybody is. And so what I found, what really worked on TikTok, and I know that this is almost like a buzz phrase in the online space now, but it's the best way that I could describe it is it's very Facetimey.

Sarah [00:10:37]:
It's very like if you were to call your entrepreneur friends and you were to, like, give them a strategy or give them a tip or something like that, that's what you would record. And it's not heavily edited and it's not heavily curated. And that is what works on TikTok, which is so different from what we're used to on Instagram.

Lindsay [00:11:01]:
Yes. And I think a lot of us started out thinking, like, oh, we have to be so professional, right? And I think, and to your point of, like, trying to be fest sound like somebody else, right? So when I started writing, it was like, and, you know, in my twenties, when you don't really know anything, like, I remember always trying to sound like somebody else, right. And it was only when I was like, wait a minute, I have my own voice and this is what it sounds like. And I think it takes a minute to, like, get to that point. And I think, and what's so awesome about you is that you're, you are, you are there. And I think what's, you know, so wonderful about finding this brand voice is that you realize, okay, I'm not for everybody, but I don't care because the people who I attract are the people who are, who I love and who love me.

Sarah [00:11:57]:
No, it's such a good point. Really good point. And I want to expand on it because I wasn't always like that. And I don't know about you, but I work very closely with a lot of my clients, like daily communication. And I adapted this mantra, if you will, of, like, I want to attract people that I would be happy to sit across the table at brunch with. I want to have a mimosa or bloody Mary with you. That's who I want to work with. And, and listen, like, we're, we don't all start like that, okay? I didn't start like that.

Sarah [00:12:34]:
If you are just very first starting out, you won't start like that. But things can evolve and change. And so I'm like, the only way I'm going to call in people that I want to brunch with is if I just show my personality. Like, I'm talking to my best friends in our group chat and I'm going to throw around some honey boo boos and shits. And fucks and, like, I'm going to throw those things around if I'm prim and proper and I'm a totally different person in my content, in my email content, in my social media, on my sales pages. And then somebody buys from me and behind the scenes, I'm this very more so, like, type b, kind of like, fuck around and find out, girly, that is not going to match. We are not going to be a match for each other. And so it's so important to, as much as you're like, oh, I want to sound like this person because they're really successful and I want what they have.

Sarah [00:13:34]:
You can still be super successful as you.

Lindsay [00:13:39]:
And I think I know, and I think that's, you know, and there's like a vulnerability piece there that I think is really hard for some people. Right. And I always talk to my clients about this, like, line of vulnerability, right? Like, you have to decide where your line is and there's no point passing the line because then it's just, like, uncomfortable, right? Like, you know, you don't have to film yourself crying over your divorce and putting it on, you know, making a reel of it if it, if that's over your line, right. Like, and I talk about this all the time. I'm like, me sharing a picture of myself in my bathing suit. Sure. I mean, cool. But that has nothing to do, there's no lesson there for my client that might be vulnerable.

Lindsay [00:14:20]:
Well, it's not really, I don't really care, but, you know, you know what I mean? Right. So there's, you kind of have to decide where that line is. And I think that that vulnerability piece is tough for people.

Sarah [00:14:32]:
This is actually really important to me. I share about my chronic illnesses on social media very publicly. And when I do it to be vulnerable, but I actually do it to be strategic as well, because I want to draw in people that are not constantly go, go, go, that don't have all the energy in the world. Maybe their fellow chronic illness girlies, maybe, or guys, maybe they are, maybe they travel a lot, maybe they're busy parents. And I want people to understand that, like, everything that I do, everything that I'm asking you to do, I'm asking you to do from a place of somebody that does not have all the energy in the world, that does not have all the time in the world, it's constantly fleeting for me. I have no idea from hour to hour what it's going to look like. And so I choose to share that. However, there is, there are things that are going on in my life right now that are so incredibly heavy that I have never outwardly shared.

Sarah [00:15:36]:
So there's really, like, there is a gray area. Like, you can be vulnerable with your audience and be transparent, but then there are also parts of your personal life that you can keep personal.

Lindsay [00:15:47]:
Yes, agreed. Right. And I. And I start singing like the gambler in my head because you're like, you have to know when to hold them and know when to fold them and know when to walk away. Right. I always get that in my head. That might be an ADHd thing anyways. Yes.

Sarah [00:16:01]:
And I'm singing things in my head.

Lindsay [00:16:04]:
Okay, cool. Okay. So I want to go back to TikTok for a second because I feel like. And what I love is what you said about it. It's just like, nobody cares. Show up. Just do the thing. Which I think I was getting in my head about it because I was just like, oh, my God, this whole new platform, right? And even when I started this podcast, I, like, I've started it, like, three times before, actually really started it, because I just was like, I was so good at other content.

Lindsay [00:16:30]:
I was like, I don't want to be bad at some other type of content. And I've talked about this before, right? Like, I feel like sometimes you have to make friends with the suck, right? You just have to be like, I'm going to suck at this for a little bit. Doesn't matter. Nobody's watching as closely as you think. And so what I love about what you said, you're just like, whatever. Like, you just show up and do something. And what I've seen other people talk about is that, you know, I've seen people say that they test stuff on TikTok, and then usually the stuff that does well on TikTok does well on Instagram. Can you talk to me about that for a sec?

Sarah [00:17:06]:
Oh, it's so true. It's the best place to test, like, your messaging, to test new ways that you say things, to test anything. Because the beautiful thing about the TikTok algorithm is that it's set up to push your content out to new people every single time you post. You don't get that in a Facebook page. You don't get that in a Facebook group. You don't get that on Instagram unless one. The post is really, really, really good. And Instagram has deemed that you will get pushed to the explore page or the reels page.

Sarah [00:17:38]:
TikTok, that's the norm. That is how the algorithm is set up. So that's why I always encourage my clients, like, okay, you don't have to use any ad spend to get pushed in front of new people. Why not? You don't have anything to lose. And so when your content gets pushed out to new people, you can really see how it resonates with a new audience. Instagram. And I will get into how I have made Instagram more of an awareness platform. Just very, very recently, this happened for me.

Sarah [00:18:13]:
But typically, and for a lot of business owners, Instagram is the place where you're speaking to your existing people.

Lindsay [00:18:20]:
Yes.

Sarah [00:18:21]:
So they kind of get used to your message. They kind of get used to you. They can use context clues from things that you've said before. But as business owners, the best thing that we can do is if you are brand new to me and you have no idea who I am, if I say this, do you understand? And if the answer is no, then we got to do a little bit of a better job. And I say that with love. The messaging and the content that I am most proud of is when my mother understands it. When my mom. Yes.

Sarah [00:18:55]:
Oh, my God. She's like a pharmaceutical meeting planner. She's not in the online business space at all. My mom, the other day, because my mini mine just started this week, she was like, oh, so you have, like, the price increase from the pre sale, and you have two spots left. And then the first week is going to. You're going to be talking about offers. And I was like, mom nailed it at you. Like, that's the best to me.

Sarah [00:19:25]:
And you know what? Like, a few years ago, my fiance, my husband now, but he was my fiance then. His mom was like, I follow you on Instagram. I don't understand a thing that you're saying, but I'm so proud of you. See, to me, that's like, I need to do a little bit of a better job of backing it up a little bit so people can understand what I'm saying. But back to testing on TikTok. It's the best. What I've done recently is I have taken my really, really well performing content from TikTok and brought it over to Instagram. And again, this is not always the norm, so take it with a grain of salt.

Sarah [00:20:01]:
I'm just telling you what happened with me is I brought a really well performing series that I did on TikTok over to Instagram, and within the span of, like, four weeks, I grew, like, 11,000 followers, and a lot of them converted into members or customers. And so it's an amazing place to test.

Lindsay [00:20:24]:
Okay. So I want to follow up on that. So I listened to a bunch of your podcasts before you came on here. So you said something about this idea, you know, and this idea of growth of your followers on Instagram. So there's still, I feel like it's still this idea of, like, the more follies you have, the more successful you are, which I don't believe. And also something you said about your mom. And I talk to this about my clients too. What did I just say? I talked to my clients about this too.

Lindsay [00:20:59]:
And I'm like, if an alien, like, landed on your profile or like, read one of your emails, would they know what you do? And I also say so much of content strategy is just like, repetition, repetition, repetition.

Sarah [00:21:10]:
Oh, my God, so much.

Lindsay [00:21:11]:
Yes. Right?

Sarah [00:21:12]:
And I always say, if you sound like a broken record, you're doing an amazing job.

Lindsay [00:21:16]:
Agreed. And I think, you know, and, like, repost your stuff from six months ago. Nobody's watching that closely. Nobody cares. So the number of followers. So is this still, like, and I remember what you, like, you said something about, like, gaining all these new followers, and they don't necessarily, it doesn't mean that they're immediate clients, right?

Sarah [00:21:39]:
Oh, no, I don't.

Lindsay [00:21:40]:
And people always think that, like, the more followers I have, the more people are going to buy from me. And I see this all the time, right? Like, I saw somebody in my local, like, women's entrepreneur group, and she was like, oh, does anybody have any experience with path social? And I was like, okay. And then obviously you start getting all these ads for it. And I was like, what are you hoping to get from working with a company like this? And she was like, oh, I just want to grow my business on Instagram. I was like, what do you mean? Like, I'm always that person, right? So can you speak to that a little bit?

Sarah [00:22:14]:
Sure. So I was already, like, fully monetizing TikTok and Instagram when, like, I started monetizing TikTok when I, before I even had a thousand followers. And I was sitting at about two to 3000 followers on Instagram for like, three years. And I was very comfortable in my business. Like, it was very much providing for me when I gain this huge influx of followers. I would be lying if I said it did not boost my income. It did. But of those, like, eleven to 12,000, a very teeny, teeny, teeny tiny percent ended up converting to a paying customer of some sort, either joining my membership or booking a strategy call now, like two or three months later, after people have lurked, some of them are now converting.

Sarah [00:23:09]:
On the other hand, I've had people that have been following me for like, three or four years that just now have bought something for the first time. Okay, I'm not saying that it needs to take years, but I'm just saying, like, there's duality in all of it. Someone can land on you and be like, oh, shit. Like, I love your vibe. You have exactly what I need. I understand what you're saying because you're not speaking in all this jargon. Like, let's fucking go. That could happen.

Sarah [00:23:39]:
Or you can have somebody that is a lurker and very analytical and really needs to sit and marinate on their decision. And it might take them a few years, but you want to be able to meet people where they're at. Which, like, back to kind of the messaging. That's why I really focus on messaging with anyone that comes to work with me. Because, I mean, you technically do want someone to be able to land on you and be like, okay, I know exactly what you do. Here's my next clear action step. But no, back to your original question. Just because you have this huge influx of followers does not mean you're going to make thousands and thousands of dollars overnight.

Lindsay [00:24:20]:
And is it still a measure of success for outside people looking in the number of followers?

Sarah [00:24:28]:
Okay, I'm going to give you my real transparent answer on this, and I've really realized this as soon as I became an entrepreneur. The unfortunate reality is, say somebody did exactly what I did and they were just as skilled and they provided an incredible experience. Like, just like me. Just like you. If somebody pulls up a profile and one person has 15,000 followers and one person has 1000 followers, unfortunately, I don't think this. Lindsey probably doesn't think this, but to, like, an average Joe people, I mean, people do look at vanity metrics, but what I want to stress to you is it's no indicator of how amazing and competent and successful that you can be. But the unfortunate reality is people do look at those followers. I hate it, but it's true.

Lindsay [00:25:36]:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Sarah [00:25:38]:
I agree with you on it.

Lindsay [00:25:41]:
I mean, yeah. And I, it's interesting, right? Like, sometimes it's always like this little, like, ego check of like, oh, why does that person have, that's right.

Sarah [00:25:53]:
It's exactly what it is. That's exactly what it is.

Lindsay [00:25:56]:
And you have to sort of check yourself and be like, wait, it's okay. It doesn't mean anything. And I think you get you know, as you get more skilled, you just, you recover quickly quicker from that. You're just like, oh, yeah, that doesn't really matter, right? And I think it's, and it's a personal thing, too, right? And I've seen people on threads be like, you know, some expert or something, and, you know, there's all these dumb bros, and they're like, oh, how, how can that person know anything? They only have 600 followers. And I'm like, and, like, comparing to somebody who has 600,000 followers, I'm like, that doesn't mean that that guy's, like, the 600 guy. The guy with 600,000 followers could still be an idiot. Like, it doesn't mean anything. Right? But I agree.

Lindsay [00:26:39]:
Like, from an external, like, perspective, looking in, yeah, we do sort of get sucked into that.

Sarah [00:26:46]:
And it's totally your ego. It's totally your ego. And it's people projecting. Like, for example, I'm sure a lot of service providers listen to this podcast, right? So, like, if you're in a, if you're in a niche or industry or at least, like, adjacent to Lindsay and I, like, I do business and content. Lindsey does, like, copyright writing and messaging. Like, we serve people outside of, like, the online business space. Like, it's not just business to business. Like, we could be working with people that are not at all, like, familiar with this online space.

Sarah [00:27:24]:
And so we, we have to also acknowledge that, like, they might have those preconceived notions as well. And let me tell you, when I first realized this. So back to, like, I would listen to business podcasts on my way to work. I would always go and creep on the guests that the podcast host had on, and I would just be enamored with them. I was like, oh, my God, they were so smart. Like, I got so much out of this free podcast. Like, I'm literally obsessed with you. Like, I want to go have coffee with you.

Sarah [00:27:58]:
And then I would go on to their profile, and I would be like, oh, my God, they only have 600 followers. And that was me, like, at the very beginning, before I knew anything. And I'm like, oh, my God, you're so good. You're so smart. You're so talented. How do you only have 600 followers? And then for me, I realized, oh, my God, it doesn't matter at all how many followers someone has. As long as they are good at their craft. That's really what matters.

Lindsay [00:28:27]:
Yeah. And I also tell people, I'm like, if you can't serve the six people, you can't serve 6000 people, right?

Sarah [00:28:36]:
Yes. Oh, my God. Yes. Yes. I still too, like, I rarely get, like, over 100 to 200 story views, and that is the primary way that I sell my shit. If I were to say, oh, I have 15,000 followers, I only have 100 story views. Oh, that's sucks. Instagram sucks.

Sarah [00:28:58]:
I'm not going to sell on my stories. Your girl would not be making any money. Okay? So I want you, even if there's 13 people, I want you to serve the shit out of those 13 people.

Lindsay [00:29:13]:
Agreed.

Sarah [00:29:14]:
Serve the crap out of them. Because again, a lot of us listening to this are service providers.

Lindsay [00:29:21]:
Yes.

Sarah [00:29:22]:
We don't need slash have the bandwidth to work in close proximity with thousands and thousands and thousands of people at a time.

Lindsay [00:29:32]:
Yeah, imagine you had 15,000 clients at once.

Sarah [00:29:34]:
No, no, that sounds actually terrible. So serve the shit out of those 13 people.

Lindsay [00:29:40]:
Please agree. And here's the other thing. So a lot of my clients come to me because they're like, I mean, usually when I work with somebody, I'm always like, okay, pick a short form type of competent and book a long form type of content. Usually that's, that's how I work with people. Right. More often than not, people choose Instagram and usually, like, email list. So I want to talk to you about that. Instagram, TikTok, that's all sort of landscape that none of us really own.

Lindsay [00:30:11]:
Right? Like the blackout of doom, social media, whatever. When you had to text people on their phone, be like, I can't access your account.

Sarah [00:30:21]:
Yeah.

Lindsay [00:30:22]:
So let's talk about that a little bit. Tell me about, like, moving people off of social media onto an email list.

Sarah [00:30:31]:
Yeah. Okay. I love this topic so much. So I want to address it in two ways. So, yes, I will talk about how I move people off of social onto my email list. But first I want to talk about. So I use TikTok, Instagram, and email pretty religiously. Like, those are my main platforms.

Sarah [00:30:48]:
I've started fucking around with threads and I kind of love it. We can talk about that later. However, if you're like, oh, my God, TikTok, Instagram, and email, that sounds frigging terrible. Three platforms. How do I come up with new content for three platforms? Like, that actually sounds miserable. I literally take the idea that I have from TikTok. Okay, like, let's do an example. Talking video on TikTok.

Sarah [00:31:13]:
I will then take that idea that I had in the talking video on TikTok, and I'll make it into, like, a trending audio on Instagram. I will then take the talking points for my TikTok and turn it into the body of my email. For my email list, the hook of my video will be my subject line. The call to action will be my button. I have not thought of a singular new idea. I'm just presenting it in the way that's native to the platform. You guys, this has saved my energy and my sanity so much. And I have never once had someone say, ew, I just watched your video on TikTok and then you sent the same concept out to your email list.

Sarah [00:31:53]:
How dare you?

Lindsay [00:31:54]:
Yeah, bro, no one's ever said literally no.

Sarah [00:31:57]:
And even my loyal people, like, they never notice. It just presented in a different way. People need to see and hear things first of all, so many times before it like clicks and they take action and they're like, oh, this is for me. So don't worry about that now. Getting people off of social media onto your email list. So the way that I do this is by offering something free. Are there other ways to grow your email list? Before all my email marketing people come at me, yes, there are other ways to grow your email list. I find for me and a lot of my clients the path of least resistance, the thing that gets us results the fastest way.

Sarah [00:32:36]:
At least right now, when we're recording this in May of June of 2024, offer your audience something for free in exchange for their email list. The harder it is to give it away for free, the better result you're going to get. So my current freebie is a private podcast and it's like an audio course about all the things I do to make money online with social media and email marketing and collaborations. I'll send it to you and you could link it in the show notes if you feel so inclined. That is literally, it hurt my soul to give it away for free. I spent a lot of time and energy and effort to literally dump my best shit into a freebie. I cannot tell you how many people still refer to like, they'll talk to me and be like, oh, well, in your private podcast, in the collab section, like, if your free shit can get people wins, they are going to pay you so much quicker.

Lindsay [00:33:45]:
Agreed.

Sarah [00:33:46]:
So that's how I found that I can get people off of social media and onto my email list. And you want it to. You want to talk about it on social media and like, if you're sharing it again to your existing email list, you want to talk about it like it's a paid thing, like you want to have the same energy behind it as you do for your paid products and offers.

Lindsay [00:34:08]:
Agreed. And I have like a whole, I have a special, like, podcast series coming up where I'm only talking about email. And one of the things we're talking about is like lead magnets. And I think, or opt ins or whatever you want to call it. And I think, you know, and I legit. I'm like looking at the notes right here, I'm like, lead Magnet. No more boring PDF's. That's what I wrote down because I feel like.

Lindsay [00:34:30]:
Right. And I think, you know, customers and clients and consumers or whatever are getting smarter. Right. And I agree. Like, it has to be super high value and, you know, this idea of high value. Right. Like, it gets thrown around, but, and I love what you said, like, it has to be, like, painful to put out there.

Sarah [00:34:53]:
One of my first clients, she was a speech therapist that sold materials on this website called teachers pay teachers. If you were ever in the education space, I'm sure you've downloaded like, worksheets for your class on there. But she said that she was like, the more painful it is to give away, the more subscribers I'm going to get onto my email list. And that has stuck with me for years. And it's so true.

Lindsay [00:35:19]:
Yeah. And I think we also have to get really creative with it. And I agree. You have to keep talking about it. One of my best performing lead magnets is my free call every Tuesday, and I kind of stopped talking about it. And then, you know, like, usually, you know, we're like six to eight people, and the past couple calls have been like two. And I'm like, oh, yeah, stop talking about it. So, yeah, and I was kind of like, oh, yeah, I have to have to tell people about it.

Lindsay [00:35:48]:
And I think that's what all, if I'm gonna wrap it up in a nice little bow, I think that's what all content is. Like, nobody's gonna know if you exist if you don't talk about what you do. And I don't think it has to be super complicated. And I think that's what I so admire so much about you. Like, sometimes you show up with your makeup on, sometimes you're, it's. Sometimes you don't. Sometimes you have your, you know, frozen swim cap on your head, you know, and that's, and I feel like you, you're giving people permission to just be like, just. And I'm going on another ADHd tangent.

Lindsay [00:36:30]:
Like, people always think as a copywriter that I'm, like, correcting everybody's grammar and I'm like, no, I'm not. I'm celebrating that you're showing up with your typos, and, like, it's better to just show up than not at all. And I think that's wrapping it back up to my. Your TikTok challenge. And I think that's where I got caught up. I was like, I don't know what these editing tools are, and I don't know what to put there. And I think you've given everybody their permission to just be like, who cares?

Sarah [00:37:05]:
Yeah. And thank you. And that means so much, because. And I was just talking about this yesterday on the welcome call for the mini mind, because I have people in there that have joined with these incredible existing offers, but there's probably things that they can make better. And for me, I still get caught up in, like, oh, well, if I change something, does that mean that, like, I'm stupid or it wasn't good in the first place, or I don't know what I'm doing, or, like, it's, again, like, back to the ego of, like, we're so attached to, like, what does this mean about me as humans? Like, oh, my God, that's totally normal. And I'm, like, holding space and validating that for you. But again, like, the best thing that we can do is say, like, oh, cool. Like, there's a way to make this easier for my people.

Sarah [00:37:55]:
No worries. Like, let me. Let me f around with that. Or, oh, cool. There's a really simple way to show up and get in front of new people. Cool. I'm gonna fuck around on TikTok for a little bit. Or threads.

Lindsay [00:38:09]:
Threads. Okay. Do you want to talk about threads?

Sarah [00:38:12]:
Yeah, I would love to.

Lindsay [00:38:13]:
Okay. So, um, like, as a writer who's quite quirky and very good at, like, just being silly, what I love, I mean, obviously there's some bullshit, because there's bullshit on every platform, but I think what the people love about it is, one, there's no images. Two, it's just, like, for those of us who don't do well with, like, planning your content for, like, a month in advance, I think it's. I mean, people keep using the word unhinged, but I don't. I'm not even sure that's the right word. I think it's just like, this random burst of inspiration moments. And what's happened, like, you mentioned this idea of collaboration. So what's happened for me anyway, is that showing up there? Yeah.

Lindsay [00:39:10]:
Some people have transferred from threads over to Instagram, and what's great about that is just the conversations, right?

Sarah [00:39:21]:
Like, just, they're really refreshing.

Lindsay [00:39:23]:
Yes. And it's sort of like a change. Just this morning I invited, like, I was part of someone's SEO Voxer day. And just this morning I was like, oh, I'd love to have an SEO person on the podcast because people are always asking me about SEO, and I'm like, yeah, I'm a copywriter. I don't know anything about that. So I just this morning asked her to come on.

Sarah [00:39:44]:
Oh, yay. I love Brittany.

Lindsay [00:39:46]:
Yes, yes, yes, that's her. So, yeah, so stuff like that, that's kind of what I love about it. So you tell me your thoughts.

Sarah [00:39:58]:
First of all, threads is totally an awareness platform. So guys don't like, I want you to fuck around with TikTok, but if you're like, I can't, it pains my soul. Threads is now another organic platform, meaning you don't have to use ad spend to get in front of new people. And I would actually really encourage you guys, if you are not on threads, to go creep on Lindsay's profile and responses, because, like, Lindsay, you and I met in a networking group, but ever since I started getting on threads again, I have become totally aware of who you are and, like, what you do and your personality, and I would have never found that out otherwise. I don't, I don't think. And so it's just a really refreshing space, and it feels like everybody's on the same playing field because it's newer. It's just like, call it like it is. It's new.

Sarah [00:40:59]:
Okay. Nobody has, like, the thread strategy to like, blow up and go viral. And really anything can go, quote unquote viral and get a lot of traction. It's really just like a brain dump.

Lindsay [00:41:16]:
Yes, that's what it is.

Sarah [00:41:18]:
I know I keep saying it, but it's just so refreshing because there's no, I mean, maybe some people are like, planning their threads in advance in a Google Doc, and that's fine for you if you like that, but it really does feel like people are kind of just like, oh, I have like an intuitive hit, I'm going to share it. Or like, oh, I really want to offer this person like, just some no strings attached advice. Share it like I comment it. And I've gotten really good at holding boundaries in the DM's of like, not giving free coaching. I will help people all the time through my free content. You can learn mostly everything you need to know through my free content. But on threads, like, somebody posted, like, I am struggling. Like, I feel like I've tried everything, and I literally reached out to her, and I was like, send me a voice message on Instagram.

Sarah [00:42:10]:
I will literally go back and forth with you until you feel okay. Literally no strings attached. Like, it just feels like we're all here doing the thing. Nobody is more superior than the other, and it's just. It's lovely.

Lindsay [00:42:26]:
Yeah. Agreed.

Sarah [00:42:28]:
And again, like, you could really feel, like, people's personality on there. Like, I posted a poll the other day, and I was like, what was.

Lindsay [00:42:35]:
It, the Harry Potter reference? Yes.

Sarah [00:42:38]:
I was like, if you could become a wizard parentheses Harry at anything, like, what would it be? And I got literally no engagement. And then I commented under it. I was like, did nobody like my Harry Potter reference? And then I got all. And then you get all this engagement. Like, people are like, oh, my God, I can't say the word wizard without saying Harry. It's just funny and light. And it takes, again, going back to that. Like, it has to work.

Sarah [00:43:04]:
It has to work. I need it to work.

Lindsay [00:43:05]:
I need you to buy that. Desperate.

Sarah [00:43:07]:
Oh, my God. It, like, lets you take. Yeah, it's just light. It lets you take a breath. Like, lets you play. Permission to play. So, yeah. If you want another awareness platform where you're not just speaking to the same people over and over and over again because that can get really stale, and then you kind of, like, lose sight of what your people want and what they respond to, that's another really good platform to go on for some new awareness.

Lindsay [00:43:34]:
Yes, yes, I agree. And I. And I think going on there, and, you know, I feel like most of us service providers, most of us got into this business because we legit, like, want to help other people, right?

Sarah [00:43:45]:
Yeah.

Lindsay [00:43:45]:
That's why we're here. This is why we do what we do. And so I think what's so great about threads is that, like. And, like, what you said, there's just, like, there's so there's less ego and there's less overthinking of content and, like, what am I gonna say today? And what am I gonna throw up? And what am I gonna send to my email list, right? Like, I joke that I talk about parenthood and my dog. Like, that's mostly what I talk about, right? And then sometimes I come up with, like, this zinger of something. I had one. I had one thread go viral, and I said something about. I don't remember.

Lindsay [00:44:25]:
It was, like, a particularly bad day. I don't remember what I said, but it, like, yeah, it went viral. And I was kind of, like, cool. And it just made me aware of so many other people.

Sarah [00:44:35]:
Yeah, yeah. And I'm bringing so many new people.

Lindsay [00:44:38]:
Yes.

Sarah [00:44:39]:
I'll click over to their profile, and I'll be on Instagram. And I'll be like, oh, my God, we're following each other. But I, like, didn't. I don't know, I just wasn't getting served what you were given.

Lindsay [00:44:49]:
Yeah, yeah, I agree. And I keep meeting all these other copywriters, too, and I'm kind of like, well, that's fun, right? And to. To be able to connect with other people in my industry, which I've never even thought about, but, you know, they keep. And I feel like I can talk about copy stuff with the other copywriters. Right. And that's where I get to be, like, super punny and, like, funny.

Sarah [00:45:15]:
Yes, yes, for sure.

Lindsay [00:45:18]:
Sarah, thank you for coming on, even though there was, like, 9000 interruptions.

Sarah [00:45:22]:
Oh, my God. That's okay. Thank you for having me. This was lovely. This was such a good, like, chitty chat this morning.

Lindsay [00:45:28]:
I love nerding out about content. I feel like I can talk about it all the time. So where can people find you? How can they work with you? And what are you offering right now?

Sarah [00:45:40]:
Yeah, so you can find me on TikTok or Instagram at. On brandbysaura. Feel free to send me a voice message on Instagram. I love me some voice messages. You can find all my links at go dot on brandbysarah.com. and the best place to jump in with me is my membership. It's called the cozy content corner. It's a community of other people that are walking the walk with you that are showing up organically on TikTok and Instagram threads.

Sarah [00:46:08]:
And it's just nice to be in community with people that get it. And I send out a weekly content report with talking head scripts and trending audios so you're not stuck in the doom scroll. But, yeah, like I said, I give away my best shit for free in my content. So if you're not ready to take a next step, like, binge my content and I promise you will get some.

Lindsay [00:46:33]:
Wins, I do the same. I don't really believe in gatekeeping. I'm kind of like, here, take it. All right. Yeah, I feel like that's just good juju. And you also have a podcast, which is also called.

Sarah [00:46:46]:
I do have a podcast, and it's also called the Cozy content corner. And I just started leaning back into solo episodes, and people seem to really enjoy them. And so listen to my podcast. You'll get more free shit.

Lindsay [00:47:01]:
Yeah. Yes. Thank you for coming. You were delightful and, oh, thank you.

Sarah [00:47:06]:
You are too.

Lindsay [00:47:07]:
Thanks for listening, everybody, and we'll see you next time. Thank you so much for listening. If you loved what you heard, don't forget to subscribe, leave a review, or share this episode on social media. And don't forget to tag me on Instagram. Lindsaysmithcreative and if you do all the three, I'll be your best friend forever and invite you to all my birthday parties. That's it for today, and I'll see you next time.